Summer TL: President Henry Wallace

[Historico]

Hmm, wasn't expecting Smathers to have such a strong Primary challenge, but Bayh is a pretty good choice for Running Mate. He'll allow Smathers to play for the Industrial States, It should be pretty interesting, and I wonder who the GOP muster up to run against the Incumbent?

[Historico]

Nelson Rockefeller/Winthrop Rockefeller '72!

It should be an interesting race in the least bit, especially with the failure of the conservative wing in the 1968 race. So the GOP Leaders will look toward to a moderate to contrast against the more conservative President Smathers. So probably former Vice President Nixon, former Governor George Romney of Michigan, Senator Chuck Percy of Illinois, Senator Mark Hatfield of Oregon, Senator Charles Mathias of Maryland. However after 8 years of Democratic Administration a Nostalgia driven campaign(Like OTL Hillary's campaign in 2008) could be picked up by Arkansas Governor and President's brother Winthrop Rockefeller and do pretty well in the political climate of 1972.

The Conservatives wont let the nomination go without a fight, A wiser more libertarian Senator Barry Goldwater of Arizona might go for the nod or might wait till '76 or 80. Congressman John Ashbrook could be a good sacrifical lamb candidate, if Smathers looks unbeatable. Senator John Tower of Texas or Senator Bob Dole of Kansas would be good picks aswell. Eagerly awaiting the next installment on the 1972 Republican Nomination and General Election HC...Keep it comming

[Historico]

Rockefeller-Goldwater, you got to love it lol...Im assuming the final results of the Republican Primary map was Goldwater:Red, Rocekfeller:Blue, Dole:Light Blue, Brooke:Green, and Percy: Lime Green. Two Southers running head to head, this should make for a very interesting General Election.

[Historico]

Wow, wasn't expecting Smathers to go for such a low blow during the campaign. The Rockefeller Presidency should be pretty interesting to see, with Rockesque Reforms in the sour economic times of the '70's. Keep it comming.

[Historico]

Hmm...That was quite a bumpy ride for Winthrop's 1st term but his 1976 rebound will make him appear stronger than he was earlier in his 1st term and probably wont recieve any serious challenge for the nomination. Goldwater's unhappiness within the adminstration will be interesting to see if he's dropped from the ticket for a younger, quiter VP...Congressman Donald Rumsfeld of Illinois, Robert Finch of California, or even John Tower of Texas could be good loyal picks.

On the Democratic Side, we will probably see another slew of candidates and probably the same ones that showed up in OTL.  And what about former Democratic Govenor Ronald Reagan of California(Taking on the role of the Tax Cutter-Era of limits Jerry Brown from OTL).. But I would also like to see Shirley Chisolm get the nomination as well...Can't wait to see what you come up with...

Reagan/Chisholm...The're the Jive Pick of '76!!!

[Historico]

Hmm McCarthy/Chisholm should gain alot more support from the New Left especially with two moderate-to-conservative in Ronnie and Winthrop. I think it would be cool to actually see the ticket win a couple of States or atleast pull Perot like numbers to swing a couple of states either way. I know there is alot of old speeches online that Reagan made IOTL when he was a still democrat in support of Truman and why liberal economics work, that could help you when writing for a Democratic Reagan. Even with the bicentennial Rose Garden Strategy working in favor of Winthrop, it's going to be pretty close...Keep it comming HC

[Historico]

Come on...Rockefeller vs. Reagan vs. McCarthy!!!We havent had a good, brutal, no holds bars, Three-Way General Election campaign in TTL yet lol jk

[Historico]

Wow...Was not expecting for Winthrop to loose or even loose in such a big way to former Governor Reagan. It will be interesting to see Reagan's differences on Domestic and Foriegn Policy as President compared to OTL. He might still be a neocon on foriegn policy due to them not having have left the party. Lol, but will he survive the horrible economic and global conditions of the late '70's...OMG I just thought about it...Goldwater vs. Reagan in 1980!!!

[Historico]

I can just see Ronnie saying this..."A Recession is when your neighbor looses his job, a depression is when you loose yours, and Recovery is when Winnie Rockefeller looses his!!!"lol. But "Are you better off than you were just four short years ago?" would work to in this scenario as well.

[Historico]

And that Barry Goldwater was less Mr. Conservative and more Mr. Libertarian...As he became a staunch oponent to social conservatives like Jerry Falwell, Pro-Choice, and a strong supporter for Gay Rights. I think he would make a very formidable candidate against a more Carteresque Reagan.

[Historico]

Im not so sure Brezhenv would have taken two Nuclear missle attacks against the Soviet Millitary so lightly. Since Detente was never really introduced by Rocky, Jack, Smathers and Winthrop, I assume that MAD(Mutually Assured Destruction) is still the nuclear policy of both nations. DC, New York and other major US cities would have been obliterated by Soviet Nukes. Having that Cowboy in the White House pushing the Nuclear Button really isn't a good idea. Nonethless I am interested in seeing where your taking it...Either Reagan's rally around the flag effect ensures him a landslide victory in 1980 or The GOP creams him in the 1980 Election for almost destroying the world lol...Im really pulling for Goldwater/Brooke 1980 now lol.

[Historico]

Sound unlikely. Is this possible that the Soviets or any other nation never developed or even researched nuclear weapon? Idea of nuclear weapon is older than Manhattan Project, and there were many opinions from scientists before how deadly it could be. It's hard to believe any government except U.S. didn't wanted to develop nuclear warfare.

I have to agree with Kal here HC, it is highly implausible seeing how much money the USSR poured into defense spending they wouldn't have come up with their own Nuclear Weapon stockpile to. Remmeber during the 50's spying on both ends is how alot of those weapons secrets go out. If you really want the US and the USSR to duke it have a couple of non nuclear skirmishes happen between both millitaries either in Berlin or Afghanistan, and have a Cuban Missle Crisisian stand off for a couple of days, but cooler heads prevail before both nations bring us to extinction as a civilization...Ronnie might have a been a staunch anticommunist but he was far from crazy lol.

I think Edward Blake/The Comedian said it best in Watchmen..."It don't matter squat because inside thirty years the nukes are gonna be flyin' like maybugs...and then Ozzy here is gonna be the smartest man on the cinder. Now, pardon me, but I got an appointment. See you in the funny papers."

So either way Im still fully onboard with this timeline and eager to see which way you go with it.

[Historico]

I think the most interesting thing about the Mondale v Reagan primary battle is that the two probably arent to significantly different ITTL as the're both of last of the New Deal Democrats but Im assuming the issues of Degree's of anticommunisim, Nuclear Freeze and etc...It's enough for Mondale to launch a threat against an incumbent President.

[Historico]

1978 Senate Election

Despite the state of the economy and Reagan's lack of popularity, the Democrats would actually make gains in the Senate, bumping up their majority to 60-40, and giving Reagan a filibuster-proof majority.
Republican Gains
-Colorado: William Armstrong
-Maine: William Cohen
-Minnesota: David Durrenberger
-South Dakota: Larry Pressler
Democratic Gains
-Massachusetts: Paul Tsongas
-Michigan: Carl Levin
-Nebraska: Jim Exon
-New Jersey: Bill Bradley
-Oklahoma: David Boren

In the House however, the Republicans would make slight gains to narrow the Democratic Majority.

Ahh Bollocks HC, lol, I thought that you were posting a full fledged update...Anyways how your having a fantastic vacation, and can't wait to see what you come up with when you get back.

[Historico]

Any third party candidates?

Nice Installment HC, wasn't expecting Dole to get the nomination but the pick of Big Jim Thompson was a great one for a running mate. Bob's stance as a Midwestern Conservative will seriously weaken Reagan's Base. Can't wait to see how the General Election turns out...Keep it comming

[Historico]

Great Installment HC,I knew old Bob Dole couldn't really stack up with Ronnie in a General Election. Can't wait to see how is second term goes...Keep it comming.

[Historico]

Great Installment HC, I wasn't expecting Ronnie to get assasinated in your timeline, Might Boby have tried to get something along OTL 25th Amendment being passed since hebasically serving out all of Reagan's term. I think an older Bobby in a less racist America than OTL 1968 would pick a Minority for Vice President. General Benjamin O' Davis Jr of DC, Congressman Andrew Young of Georgia, Governor Dixie Lee Ray of Washington, Congresman Harold Ford Sr. of Tennesse, Congresswoman Barbara Jordan of Texas, Julian Bond and Jesse Jackson of Illinois would all be good choices for a VP Pick. Can't wait to see how the '84 election turns out...Keep it comming

[Historico]

Hmm a Kennedy/Ford Ticket seems pretty strong going into the General Election, despite the Connally challenge from the right of the Party. Btw HC, could we see a Primary Map for the Democrats? and also The site here has good pics of the Democratic Vice Presidential nominee... http://thadmatthews.blogspot.com/2007_09_01_archive.html .Can't wait to see what you have in store for the Republican Nomination race.

[Historico]

In regards to the primary map, in this case Connally only won a few states, so I didn't think it was worth it. I meant to do one for the 1980 GOP, but somehow I screwed up.



By the way Historico, that was a weird site that you linked to!

Lol, yeah, I just googled images for Harold Ford Sr. and those where the best one's that could be skewed to be involving the Vice Presidential Nominee in Action campaigning or on the stump. I didn't realize that it was a crazy blog sight lol.

[Historico]

I really hope that Jack Kemp might win the GOP Nomination or even the presidency one day ITTL lol...But as for my endorsement of the candidates,"I choose to stay the course and vote for Kennedy/Ford in '84!!!" lol

[Historico]

Nice Update on the '84 General Election, although I think Bobby's second term will not be a cakewalk that's for sure. Once word get's out about Vice President Ford's indictment out of Tennesse for his plea bargin deals, there's probably going to be alot of pressure for the Nation's 1st black VP to resign. And with Bobby's administration probably full of Neoconservatives the likes of Scoop Jackson and Jeane Kirkpatrik, Iran Contra may still happen ITTL and Bobby just might have had an actual role in the dealings than OTL Reagan did. Either way I perdict it's going to be very hard for the Dem's to win in '88...Go Jack Kemp lol

[Historico]

Did we clarify or not if the 22nd Amendment still passed ITTL? If so, Bobby would be ineligable to run for a "Second" term in '88 due him having served out over two years of Ronnie's expired term. If not He's probably going down in a miserable defeat in '88 or it will be interesting to see if Ford get's the nod...Keep it comming.

[Historico]

Did we clarify or not if the 22nd Amendment still passed ITTL? If so, Bobby would be ineligable to run for a "Second" term in '88 due him having served out over two years of Ronnie's expired term. If not He's probably going down in a miserable defeat in '88 or it will be interesting to see if Ford get's the nod...Keep it comming.

It was never passed due to no real political motivation. Believe me, 1988 is going to be a heck of a race!

Hmm...I would there would have been more of a push to get it passed ITTL, seeing as no one really wanted Wallace to be President in the first place lol. Btw, I think you havent had an Incumbent President decline to seek Reelection yet, which could have some very interesting ramifications. It would be Kinda Ironic for Bobby to leave office in the most Johnsonesque way seeing how much they despised eachother IOTL. But anyways I trust you when you say it's going to be one heck of an race, so Keep it comming lol.

[Historico]

Wow...A Gephardt/Gore ticket can't say I saw that one coming...With OTL GOPer's such as Gramm and Robertson still Democrat's ITTL...Who would be potential GOP Holds? I could see due to both of his uncles making lt to the Presidency Jay Rockefeller might have stayed a Republican. He's the only one I can think off that could be a potential candiate in an ALT '88 Primaries. Other than that I think the candidates will probably be split almost on a regional basis.

Governor George Deukemijan of California
Representative Manuel Lujan of New Mexico
Senator Nancy Kassembaum of Kansas
Governor Bill Clements of Texas
Representative Richard Cheney of Wyoming
Governor Big Jim Tompson of Illinois
Senator Dan Quayle of Indiana
Governor Tom Kean of New Jersey
Representative Jack Kemp of New York.

My pick...Kemp/Rockefeller '88!

[Historico]

Solid update...Can't say I saw the pick of Ross Perot for Kemp's VP...But It's a nice way of getting Perot into the White House in '96 or something. As for Anderson picking Stockdale, I don't think it Stockdale would be the best pick for VP, Someone like Dick Lamm would have balanced the NR ticket quite nicely. Can't wait to see how the General Election between Gephardt/Gore vs. Kemp/Perot vs. Anderson/Stockdale? lol turns out.