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Author Topic: Greece 2012  (Read 45316 times)
Bacon King
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« Reply #300 on: May 06, 2012, 03:25:21 pm »
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39.39% reporting (8117/20605 precincts)

Leftists and nationalists gain vote share at the expense of PASOK and ND. SYRIZA gains a seat from the Commies.

ND:         112   20.28%
SYRIZA:    49   15.86%
PASOK:    43    13.98%
ANEL:       32   10.39%
KKE:         25    8.31%
XA:           21    6.85%
DIMAR:     18    5.99%
LAOS:               2.90%
Greens:            2.81%
DISY:                2.49%
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Bacon King
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« Reply #301 on: May 06, 2012, 03:33:10 pm »
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Sorry, but how can they just call new elections? Some sort of runoff system?
If no one can form a government quickly, there are new elections. Greece has the rules on that set down fairly tightly. There's a discussion of it; in the "super predictions" thread IIRC.

It was earlier in this thread, actually. Smiley Here's a repost, given the, er, likelihood that these results end up being an unworkable mess for everyone involved:

Given the high likelihood of an incredibly fractured Parliament, here's the procedure for forming a government in Greece in the absence of a Parliamentary majority:

  • As soon as the new Parliament takes office, the President gives the leader of the largest party an exploratory mandate, and this leader has three days to form a Government that can hold the confidence of Parliament.
  • If the first party can't form a government in three days, the President gives the leader of the second largest party an exploratory mandate, again with three days.
  • If that party can't form a government in time either, then the President gives the third largest party's leader an exploratory mandate and another three three days.
(note: in the event of a tie in seat total, the party with more votes in the last election takes precedence. If there's a tie for third place [or a three-way tie for second place, I suppose] the President has the option of giving a fourth exploratory mandate to the tied party. In no circumstance can he give more than four.)
  • If all of the exploratory mandates fail, the President is required to convene and chair a meeting of all Parliamentary party leaders (even inviting, if he desires, the leaders of parties too small to form official Parliamentary groups). At this meeting, one last chance exists for the various party leaders to negotiate and attempt to form a coalition.
  • If that fails too, the President must "make every endeavor" to have an all-party unity government formed in order to immediately administer new elections.
  • If the President can't even get the parties to cooperate for that, he has to pick one of the Chief Justices of Greece's three Supreme Courts to form a Cabinet to call for new elections. The President then dissolves Parliament.


Essentially, Greece has some pretty strict time limits for coalition negotiations that could lead to a very intense nine/ten days, and if ND (assuming they're the largest party, o/c) can't manage to form a government in 72 hours, then the parties that have the second and third most seats suddenly become much more important (and there's like six different parties those could be).
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Bacon King
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« Reply #302 on: May 06, 2012, 03:42:09 pm »
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42.69% reporting (8796/20605 precincts)
Big loser in this batch is ND; big gains for the commies suggest this is one of those areas where KKE always does well.

ND:         112   20.21%
SYRIZA:    49   15.90%
PASOK:    43    13.95%
ANEL:       32   10.40%
KKE:         25    8.37%
XA:           21    6.85%
DIMAR:     18    5.99%
LAOS:               2.89%
Greens:            2.81%
DISY:                2.50%
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« Reply #303 on: May 06, 2012, 03:59:14 pm »
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New Democracy look about to fall under 20%, and SYRIZA above 16%.
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« Reply #304 on: May 06, 2012, 03:59:18 pm »
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47.17% reporting (9720/20605 precincts)

PASOK loses a seat to KKE. ND and PASOK vote share is falling; SYRIZA biggest winner in this batch. DISY and Greens both inching towards the quota, while LAOS shows little movement

ND:  112    20.09%
SYRIZA:    49    15.99%
PASOK:    42    13.87%
ANEL:    32    10.42%
KKE:    26    8.37%
XA:    21    6.84%
DIMAR:    18    6.00%
LAOS:       2.88%
Greens:       2.82%
DISY:       2.57%

(I made the results an actual table so it looks nicer Smiley)
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Bacon King
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« Reply #305 on: May 06, 2012, 04:23:23 pm »
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About to post new results once the next batch of precincts come in and there's over 50% reporting, but here's minor party results right now:

DX!: 1.98% (centrists)
Drasi: 1.64% (liberal)
ANTARSYA: 1.16% (revolutionary communist)
parties without one percent: 5.37% (a wide variety, including Pirates, another Green party, a half dozen communist splinter groups, some perennial candidates, independent alliances, and the current parliamentary caucus KOISY)

My favorite minor party names would have to be "Renewing Independent Left, Renewing Right, Renewing Pasok, Renewing New Democracy, No to War, Party of Action, I Give Away Land, I Give Away Debts, Save Lives, Panagrarian Labour Movement of Greece" (perennial candidate) as well as "Communist Party of Greece (Marxist-Leninist) – Marxist-Leninist Communist Party of Greece" (a union of two splinter groups).
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Bacon King
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« Reply #306 on: May 06, 2012, 04:28:21 pm »
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52.54% reporting (10825/20605 precincts)

ND loses a seat to DIMAR. PASOK is falling dramatically, ND losing vote share as well. SYRIZA within four points of the lead now.

ND:  111    20.02%
SYRIZA:    49    16.09%
PASOK:    42    13.75%
ANEL:    32    10.45%
KKE:    26    8.36%
XA:    21    6.87%
DIMAR:    19    6.00%
LAOS:       2.87%
Greens:       2.83%
DISY:       2.54%
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« Reply #307 on: May 06, 2012, 04:35:04 pm »
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My favorite minor party names would have to be "Renewing Independent Left, Renewing Right, Renewing Pasok, Renewing New Democracy, No to War, Party of Action, I Give Away Land, I Give Away Debts, Save Lives, Panagrarian Labour Movement of Greece" (perennial candidate) as well as "Communist Party of Greece (Marxist-Leninist) – Marxist-Leninist Communist Party of Greece" (a union of two splinter groups).

This party is cool to: ""Can't Pay, Won't Pay" Movement". Now because of the election result the negotiations for cabinet are going to be tough. I hope that SYRIZA is going to lead the cabinet. How could ND form a majority?
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« Reply #308 on: May 06, 2012, 04:40:42 pm »
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I guess they can try to form a Europhile ND-PASOK-DIMAR government based on keeping Greece in the EU and minor tweeks in the deal with EU.
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Bacon King
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« Reply #309 on: May 06, 2012, 04:46:11 pm »
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55.96% reporting (11527/20605 precincts)

ND and PASOK vote share continue to collapse. SYRIZA gains a seat from DIMAR. Greens keep inching towards threshold and may soon overtake LAOS.

ND:  111    19.98%
SYRIZA:    50    16.12%
PASOK:    42    13.69%
ANEL:    32    10.44%
KKE:    26    8.38%
XA:    21    6.87%
DIMAR:    18    6.01%
LAOS:       2.87%
Greens:       2.84%
DISY:       2.53%
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« Reply #310 on: May 06, 2012, 04:48:54 pm »
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I know this is a bit late to be asking, but what do the parties generally stand for?
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« Reply #311 on: May 06, 2012, 04:49:26 pm »
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I guess the big question is whether more parties get in or not?
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« Reply #312 on: May 06, 2012, 04:54:51 pm »
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If a non-ND government is formed this would be a case of the largest party not participating in government, I wonder when the last time that has happened in Europe.  If they didn't have the ridiculous seat bonus, I'm guessing it would be fairly likely that they wouldn't be able to form a coalition but I wonder with that seat bonus if they will have enough seats to form some weird coalition.
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« Reply #313 on: May 06, 2012, 04:57:07 pm »
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If a non-ND government is formed this would be a case of the largest party not participating in government, I wonder when the last time that has happened in Europe. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danish_parliamentary_election,_2011
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« Reply #314 on: May 06, 2012, 04:57:19 pm »
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I think having the seat bonus may actually make things more difficult... without it a SYRIZA-PASOK-KKE-DIMAR coalition might be able to get hobbled together.
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« Reply #315 on: May 06, 2012, 04:59:10 pm »
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I think having the seat bonus may actually make things more difficult... without it a SYRIZA-PASOK-KKE-DIMAR coalition might be able to get hobbled together.

Hmmm, PASOK and KKE in the same cabinet would be interesting.
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« Reply #316 on: May 06, 2012, 05:00:23 pm »
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If a non-ND government is formed this would be a case of the largest party not participating in government, I wonder when the last time that has happened in Europe. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Danish_parliamentary_election,_2011

Even better example might be Belgium 2010:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belgian_general_election,_2010
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Bacon King
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« Reply #317 on: May 06, 2012, 05:00:44 pm »
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I know this is a bit late to be asking, but what do the parties generally stand for?

Some blatant oversimplifications:

PASOK: center-left, pro-austerity, historically major party
ND: center-right, pro-austerity, historically major party
KKL: communist hard-liners, historically third party (with 7-8% vote ceiling)
SYRIZA: left, anti-austerity
DIMAR: center-left, somewhat ambiguous towards austerity
ANEL: right, anti-austerity
XA: fascist, anti-immigrant and anti-austerity
LAOS: right, anti-immigrant, somewhat ambiguous towards austerity
DISY: centrist to center-right, pro-austerity
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Bacon King
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« Reply #318 on: May 06, 2012, 05:04:27 pm »
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61.06% reporting (12581/20605 precincts)

ND and PASOK keep falling, SYRIZA keeps gaining; Greens almost overtaking LAOS.

ND:  111    19.80%
SYRIZA:    50    16.22%
PASOK:    42    13.65%
ANEL:    32    10.49%
KKE:    26    8.39%
XA:    21    6.89%
DIMAR:    18    6.02%
LAOS:       2.86%
Greens:       2.85%
DISY:       2.55%
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« Reply #319 on: May 06, 2012, 05:09:35 pm »
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KKE would never have participated in any government, certainly not with PASOK and most definitely not with SYRIZA. KKE formally ruled out any coalition with anybody.
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« Reply #320 on: May 06, 2012, 05:15:31 pm »
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"Renewing Independent Left, Renewing Right, Renewing Pasok, Renewing New Democracy, No to War, Party of Action, I Give Away Land, I Give Away Debts, Save Lives, Panagrarian Labour Movement of Greece" (perennial candidate)
Joke candidate?
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« Reply #321 on: May 06, 2012, 05:16:50 pm »
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I wonder what will happen if ND and PASOK form another coalition?  If I were Greek I would scream bloody murder.
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« Reply #322 on: May 06, 2012, 05:21:12 pm »
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Why is austerity bad, and what is the alternative?
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Bacon King
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« Reply #323 on: May 06, 2012, 05:22:01 pm »
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Parties in first by electoral district, sorted by percent reporting so far
90%-100% reporting: 6 total; 6 ND
80%-90% reporting: 7 total; 5 ND, 1 KKE, 1 SYRIZA
70%-80% reporting: 11 total; 8 ND, 2 PASOK, 1 SYRIZA
60%-70% reporting: 16 total; 11 ND, 5 SYRIZA
50%-60% reporting: 12 total; 6 ND, 2 PASOK, 4 SYRIZA
40%-50% reporting:4 total; 1 ND, 3 SYRIZA

Looks like the gap between ND and SYRIZA will continue to narrow.
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Bacon King
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« Reply #324 on: May 06, 2012, 05:26:27 pm »
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"Renewing Independent Left, Renewing Right, Renewing Pasok, Renewing New Democracy, No to War, Party of Action, I Give Away Land, I Give Away Debts, Save Lives, Panagrarian Labour Movement of Greece" (perennial candidate)
Joke candidate?

Indeed.

Why is austerity bad, and what is the alternative?

People hate it because it's caused massive cuts in pensions, minimum wage, and universal tax hikes while the economy is in the hole and unemployment is astronomical. No alternative though that doesn't involve leaving the Eurozone, and even then there'd still be horrible economic repercussions. (or, that's my understanding anyway, don't know too much about the details).
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