Republicans, do you expect ANY gay people to vote for the Republican?

[Gravis Marketing]

Angus, I'm certain you recall that Clinton set out to repeal the ban on gays serving openly and he resorted to DADT after the military brass (led by moderate hero Colin Powell), Republicans, and conservative Democrats blocked him.

[angus]

Angus, I'm certain you recall that Clinton set out to repeal the ban on gays serving openly...

I'm certain I recall this and many, many other promises made and then broken by Bill Clinton, but that's a subject for another thread.

[opebo]

Support for Republicans at the ballot box among gay people went from 24% in 2006, to 19% in 2008, to 31% in 2010.

I find your knowledge of such information...disturbing.

Why?  Its not from the bathroom wall.

[TheDeadFlagBlues]

Support for Republicans at the ballot box among gay people went from 24% in 2006, to 19% in 2008, to 31% in 2010.

I find your knowledge of such information...disturbing.

This is a forum about psephology, there are plenty of non-gay posters that know that information.

[Gravis Marketing]

Angus, I'm certain you recall that Clinton set out to repeal the ban on gays serving openly...

I'm certain I recall this and many, many other promises made and then broken by Bill Clinton, but that's a subject for another thread.

If Clinton proposed something and lost in congress, you consider that he broke a promise?

[angus]

It was a promise he probably didn't intend to keep.  He was, after all, a master at triangulation.  Had he wanted to, he could have, as commander-in-chief, outflanked the congress.  They beat him to the punch, and he really didn't mind.  He also could have joined a suit against it, but chose not to.  It was his compromise measure.  To this day, he claims not to have chosen the policy.  He is a clever politician, but it's not really germane to the thread. 

[Governor Scott]

Being gay and voting Republican is voting against your own interests.

[Inks.LWC Supports Chuck Hagel]

Yes.  And I know 2 who are.

[Ogre Mage]

Gay Republicans are in the minority and tend to be shunned by the broader gay community, but they certainly are not unheard of.  Typically they subscribe to the party's doctrine on economic and foreign policy and simply try to overlook the fact that the party works against who they are.  Some can get quite delusional in their excuses about this.  For those who are economically well off and white, they tend to be more insulated against discrimination than less fortunate gays.  Ignoring gay rights is a luxury they can afford.

At the state level, the push for gay rights is occurring almost exclusively through the Democratic Party.  In Washington State for instance, the vast majority of votes for the anti-discrimination (2006), domestic partner (2007) and same-sex marriage (2012) bills came from the Democratic Party and were signed into law by a Democratic Governor.  The vast majority of nay votes came from the GOP.

Frankly, I think to be a gay Republican is to admit that equality for LGBT is not important to you.  If it was, you would not be supporting the Republican Party.  Your choice, but don't be surprised when other LGBT look at you with contempt.  

[President Marokai]

There are plenty of gay people who vote Republican, they just happen to be the type of queer I have no desire to get to know.

[asexual trans victimologist]

There are plenty of gay people who vote Republican, they just happen to be the type of queer I have no desire to get to know.

I knew Nan Hayworth's son for a time. We were friends for a while, but in retrospect he was exactly the sort of person one might think he would be.

[NY Jew]

The point is in state like New York, and others, the republicans are not as offensive and obsessed with gay rights as the many of the people running for the GOP on a national level. I can say that the state and local officials where I'm from are far to the left of Romney on gay issues, lets not even mention Santorum. For this reason, I have no problem as a gay person voting republican. I recently moved to Missouri, however and the story is completely different

the fact that people were concerned with fighting against marriage redefinition led to congressman Bob Turner, and will soon lead to State Senator David Storobin.

[asexual trans victimologist]

The point is in state like New York, and others, the republicans are not as offensive and obsessed with gay rights as the many of the people running for the GOP on a national level. I can say that the state and local officials where I'm from are far to the left of Romney on gay issues, lets not even mention Santorum. For this reason, I have no problem as a gay person voting republican. I recently moved to Missouri, however and the story is completely different

the fact that people were concerned with fighting against marriage redefinition led to congressman Bob Turner, and will soon lead to State Senator David Storobin.

That's your specific part of New York. It's not representative.

Also, from what I've heard Storobin, uh, isn't exactly favored. Though I haven't actually heard all that much.

[NY Jew]

The point is in state like New York, and others, the republicans are not as offensive and obsessed with gay rights as the many of the people running for the GOP on a national level. I can say that the state and local officials where I'm from are far to the left of Romney on gay issues, lets not even mention Santorum. For this reason, I have no problem as a gay person voting republican. I recently moved to Missouri, however and the story is completely different

the fact that people were concerned with fighting against marriage redefinition led to congressman Bob Turner, and will soon lead to State Senator David Storobin.

That's your specific part of New York. It's not representative.

Also, from what I've heard Storobin, uh, isn't exactly favored. Though I haven't actually heard all that much.

want to make a bet on Storobin.

[Holmes]

There is a very real, very creepy Republican gay culture.

Well, guns rights are gay rights.

[asexual trans victimologist]

The point is in state like New York, and others, the republicans are not as offensive and obsessed with gay rights as the many of the people running for the GOP on a national level. I can say that the state and local officials where I'm from are far to the left of Romney on gay issues, lets not even mention Santorum. For this reason, I have no problem as a gay person voting republican. I recently moved to Missouri, however and the story is completely different

the fact that people were concerned with fighting against marriage redefinition led to congressman Bob Turner, and will soon lead to State Senator David Storobin.

That's your specific part of New York. It's not representative.

Also, from what I've heard Storobin, uh, isn't exactly favored. Though I haven't actually heard all that much.

want to make a bet on Storobin.

Not really. As I said, I'm not terribly familiar with the race.

It remains that your district isn't really representative of other conservative areas of New York, though, partially since as I'm sure you recognize it's not conservative in the same ways or for the same reasons that places like a lot of rural upstate are.

[lowtech redneck]

There are plenty of gay people who vote Republican, they just happen to be the type of queer I have no desire to get to know.

Well, that's not close-minded at all....

[NY Jew]

The point is in state like New York, and others, the republicans are not as offensive and obsessed with gay rights as the many of the people running for the GOP on a national level. I can say that the state and local officials where I'm from are far to the left of Romney on gay issues, lets not even mention Santorum. For this reason, I have no problem as a gay person voting republican. I recently moved to Missouri, however and the story is completely different

the fact that people were concerned with fighting against marriage redefinition led to congressman Bob Turner, and will soon lead to State Senator David Storobin.

That's your specific part of New York. It's not representative.

Also, from what I've heard Storobin, uh, isn't exactly favored. Though I haven't actually heard all that much.

want to make a bet on Storobin.

Not really. As I said, I'm not terribly familiar with the race.

It remains that your district isn't really representative of other conservative areas of New York, though, partially since as I'm sure you recognize it's not conservative in the same ways or for the same reasons that places like a lot of rural upstate are.

I don't live anywhere near that district.

There are many areas down state that vote based on marriage both Jewish and Catholic.

[asexual trans victimologist]

The point is in state like New York, and others, the republicans are not as offensive and obsessed with gay rights as the many of the people running for the GOP on a national level. I can say that the state and local officials where I'm from are far to the left of Romney on gay issues, lets not even mention Santorum. For this reason, I have no problem as a gay person voting republican. I recently moved to Missouri, however and the story is completely different

the fact that people were concerned with fighting against marriage redefinition led to congressman Bob Turner, and will soon lead to State Senator David Storobin.

That's your specific part of New York. It's not representative.

Also, from what I've heard Storobin, uh, isn't exactly favored. Though I haven't actually heard all that much.

want to make a bet on Storobin.

Not really. As I said, I'm not terribly familiar with the race.

It remains that your district isn't really representative of other conservative areas of New York, though, partially since as I'm sure you recognize it's not conservative in the same ways or for the same reasons that places like a lot of rural upstate are.

I don't live anywhere near that district.

There are many areas down state that vote based on marriage both Jewish and Catholic.

There are also many otherwise Republican-leaning areas that aren't particularly conservative on this issue.

[Torie]

A lot of gay people don't think gay related issues are the most important ones with which America needs to deal right now.

[asexual trans victimologist]

A lot of gay people don't think gay related issues are the most important ones with which America needs to deal right now.

They're still voting against their own (and other people's, let's not forget) rights for utilitarian reasons, which in my view is both morally and mentally questionable.

[Grad Students are the Worst]

A lot of gay people don't think gay related issues are the most important ones with which America needs to deal right now.

They're still voting against their own (and other people's, let's not forget) rights for utilitarian reasons, which in my view is both morally and mentally questionable.

I'm not sure their understanding of utility is necessarily so distinct from their sense of morality.  Although it's hard for me to imagine how they can feel especially comfortable in a party so overtly committed to assuring their relationships are codified as inferior.  I think it's totally defensible, but yikes.

[asexual trans victimologist]

A lot of gay people don't think gay related issues are the most important ones with which America needs to deal right now.

They're still voting against their own (and other people's, let's not forget) rights for utilitarian reasons, which in my view is both morally and mentally questionable.

I'm not sure their understanding of utility is necessarily so distinct from their sense of morality.  Although it's hard for me to imagine how they can feel especially comfortable in a party so overtly committed to assuring their relationships are codified as inferior.  I think it's totally defensible, but yikes.

Oh, I totally understand how someone with a utilitarian viewpoint could end up making those decisions, but I am by nature very much a deontologist so it's somewhat off-putting to me, to say the least.

Most people are utilitarians for other people and deontologists for themselves. It's one of the most common, one could almost say near-universal human character flaws. People who are utilitarians for themselves, while I can intellectually admire their consistency, give me the willies.

[Grad Students are the Worst]

A lot of gay people don't think gay related issues are the most important ones with which America needs to deal right now.

They're still voting against their own (and other people's, let's not forget) rights for utilitarian reasons, which in my view is both morally and mentally questionable.

I'm not sure their understanding of utility is necessarily so distinct from their sense of morality.  Although it's hard for me to imagine how they can feel especially comfortable in a party so overtly committed to assuring their relationships are codified as inferior.  I think it's totally defensible, but yikes.

Oh, I totally understand how someone with a utilitarian viewpoint could end up making those decisions, but I am by nature very much a deontologist so it's somewhat off-putting to me, to say the least.

Most people are utilitarians for other people and deontologists for themselves. It's one of the most common, one could almost say near-universal human character flaws. People who are utilitarians for themselves, while I can intellectually admire their consistency, give me the willies.

I'm sure there are people who hold deontological justifications for conservative positions.  Surely you've met super-libertarian types.

Why do utilitarian people give you the willies?  Both are accepting first principles in the same way.

[Zach Vega]

Do you expect gays to only care about gay issues?

This.